Title: 2007 NFL Offseason Thread
jamiegeist - March 1, 2007 11:07 PM (GMT)
Wanted to get this going, cause I'm interested to see what ES thinks of this first move to open up the offseason:
Denver trades RB Tatum Bell, T George Foster, and (reportedly) 5th round 2007 draft pick to
Detroit Lions for CB Dre Bly
I personally think it is a horrible move by Denver. It leaves them still unproven Mike Bell and Cedric Cobbs at RB, and upgrades their CB position greatly, from a dead guy to a good #2. Bly's on the downward spiral though. He's only started a full season once since going to Detroit 5 years ago, and had a career low for picks (3) last year.
This is the first of many, many moves, as free agency officially starts at 12:01 Eastern tonight.
Notable releases so far: RB Jamal Lewis, LB Joey Porter, QB Drew Bledsoe, WR Joe Horn, CB Fred Smoot.
Another notable move that people were expecting to make waives: RB Michael Turner given highest possible tender. Meaning if anyone wants him, they'll have to give San Diego a 1st and 3rd round pick. Thats a HUGE asking price for anybody in this league.
dynamite kido - March 1, 2007 11:21 PM (GMT)
Well, I would probably agree that it's a bad move for Denver. Although they are probably believing in their own hype (although it does seem to ring true) that they can have anyone back there and get a thousand yard back. I know they were in despirate need for a CB since their starting one last year was killed, so I think it's more that than anything else. Personally though I think they probably could've traded the same guys elsewhere and got a better corner than Bly too. In all actuality they probably should've tried to strategize a bit for draft day which is where they SHOULD be looking for a corner.
As far as the guys being released the only one that I don't get is Jamal Lewis. Baltimore is nuts if they think they'll have a better back in their than him next year, unless they are thinking of making a play for Corey Dillion (who isn't as good as Lewis is anyway).
As a hardcore Steeler fan, I really don't like the Joey Porter move but I know why they did it. Truthfully they should have attempted to resign him considering their biggest holes on the team are in two places. Wide Reciever and Linebacker. But maybe this is just another indication that they are actually going to the 4-3 defense which I don't like either because the Steelers don't have that type of personel. Unless they have big free agency plans that I don't know about yet.
eStragand - March 1, 2007 11:21 PM (GMT)
Yow! I hadn't heard this. Last I heard was that they were trading a 3rd round pick for Bly. I don't think it's a bad move at all.
Even if Darrent Williams was still alive, I'd still campaign for a new CB. So I'm ecstatic that the position's been upgraded with Bly.
Tatum Bell was the best RB on the Donkeys this year...but 100% replaceable. He's had fumble and durability problems his entire career (all of 2.25 years, but hey).
Surprised they threw in Foster. Yes, that's what it was-- a throw-in. Coaches have been down on him for awhile now. He also never fit the Donkeys' o-line mode (smaller, quicker white guys).
The Donkeys are also expected to look for a starting RB via free agency or the draft. Shanahan wanted to draft Laurence Marooney last year. Michael Turner (LT's backup in San Diego) was supposed to be their main target. Now that Jamal Lewis is available, I wouldn't be surprised if they go after him. Mike Bell and Cedric Cobbs are not the starters. I'd be okay with Cobbs, but if Mike Bell is the starter I'm giving up on the '07 team on Sept.1. Jackass runs STRAIGHT-UP, backs into contact and is a big reason the team missed the playoffs. Fuck Mike Bell.
Mad Dog - March 1, 2007 11:24 PM (GMT)
Why didn't Baltimore keep Chester Taylor if they were just going to cut Lewis a year later?
dynamite kido - March 1, 2007 11:25 PM (GMT)
Probably because they thought that Lewis was going to be back in his 2000 yard season mode, which isn't the case.
The problem with Baltimore isn't the talent, it's Billick. He's easily the most overrated coach in the league and it's retarded when anyone refers to him as an Offensive mastermind.
Mad Dog - March 1, 2007 11:31 PM (GMT)
Also Denver made an awful deal. Dre Bly is the answer to no one's problems and definately not at the insane price they paid to get him.
dynamite kido - March 1, 2007 11:35 PM (GMT)
Correct me if I'm wrong but Bly has quite the salary doesn't he?
eStragand - March 1, 2007 11:35 PM (GMT)
A bigger problem with Baltimore is that they have MALE CHEERLEADERS, but whatever...
Does that mean My Buddy, Mike Anderson is now the #1 RB in Baltimore? Or at least temporarily until the draft.
Again... Foster and Bell were not being productive. Foster was benched in midseason and Bell kept fumbling. On paper, his 1,000 yards may look impressive, but most of those (about 720 or so) came before his midseason injury slump. His durablity has been a BIG question since he was drafted.
Mad Dog - March 1, 2007 11:37 PM (GMT)
He's probably getting between 7 and 8 million this year.
dynamite kido - March 2, 2007 12:17 AM (GMT)
| QUOTE (Mad Dog @ Mar 1 2007, 05:37 PM) |
| He's probably getting between 7 and 8 million this year. |
So in other words, needing a corner or not Denver was fucking insane to make that deal happen.
eStragand - March 2, 2007 04:20 AM (GMT)
A restructuring isn't out of the question, either. When Champ Bailey was acquired, he was due for a bunch, but they re-worked it to around 3-4 mil. The tradition on the Donkeys is that nobody ever gets paid for what they sign for. Elway's still on the payroll for "deferred salary" until 2020 or something.
Where are you getting the salary figures from? I can't find any up-to-date resource and I'm curious to see what Bell and Foster were scheduled to make.
jamiegeist - March 2, 2007 06:11 AM (GMT)
Madden 07 is probably your best guess, even though those numbers constantly change (in real life that is).
eStragand - March 2, 2007 07:00 AM (GMT)
MADDEN?! Well, if we're using those player stats, then I guess Tatum Bell would be a "94 overall" as a RB, which is grossly overrated. Then the Donkeys need to trade for Tecmo Bowl Bo Jackson and they'll be set.
According to ESPN.com, they're expected to work on a long-term contract with Bly. 3 or 4 years, I'd imagine. Also, the Donkeys are getting the Lions 6th round pick in the deal.
Everyone around here is calling this a coup. Get rid of guys that weren't in the long-term plans and weren't going to start, for a starting corner. Alot of people are speculating that they'll trade Plummer and their first round pick to move up and select Adrian Peterson. A trade is possible, but Plummer's not the Valuable Commodity that Donkey fans think he is.
Also, I had to cruise the OrangeMange site for some details. Fuck, I hate Donkey fans....
jamiegeist - March 2, 2007 08:27 AM (GMT)
Dre Bly isn't in the longterm plans either. I mean, the motherfucker is 30. And I'm not sure what peices Denver could possibly have to trade to get into the top 3 picks. They honestly don't have enough to trade, and most teams in the league don't either.
Not happenin.
I'm gonna go out on a limb:
Ricky Williams
dynamite kido - March 2, 2007 03:35 PM (GMT)
I think that they are just going to make a play for Jamal Lewis, or they are going to keep what they have.
Mad Dog - March 2, 2007 03:53 PM (GMT)
Browns are after Nate Clements and Eric Steinbach for their top free agent signings. I think both would be great additions for the team if signed. Though I think Clements wants too much money and that deal won't happen.
eStragand - March 2, 2007 04:43 PM (GMT)
| QUOTE (jamiegeist @ Mar 2 2007, 01:27 AM) |
Dre Bly isn't in the longterm plans either. I mean, the motherfucker is 30. And I'm not sure what peices Denver could possibly have to trade to get into the top 3 picks. They honestly don't have enough to trade, and most teams in the league don't either.
Not happenin.
I'm gonna go out on a limb:
Ricky Williams |
3 or 4 years for a guy who'll be 30 in May isn't that bad. Again, most guys rarely get paid for their entire contracts or are around for the duration. Look at Brian Griese, who was signed to a longterm contract after the 2000 season and was let go after the 2002 season. Billy Jenkins, Eddie Kennison, Lester Archambeau, Dale Carter, Tony Carter and others were all free agent signees who never got to live out their contracts.
Never said that they'd trade up for a top THREE pick. Trade up, probably. But I agree that the chances of getting a top 3, let alone a top 10 pick are nil. They traded up on draft day last year to get Jay Cutler. Wouldn't be unheard of to do the same for a RB this year.
Ricky Williams? Heh... stranger shit has happened. See: Maurice Clarett. Although I really want Ron Dayne back :( That was probably their dumbest move of the '06 pre-season. And just to say it again: Fuck you, Mike Bell. I never get sick of saying that.
Big F'N Swigg - March 2, 2007 06:47 PM (GMT)
Apparently, Plummer has retired
eStragand - March 2, 2007 06:55 PM (GMT)
Yeah, I'm seeing that come across the wire, now. BUT..it's being reported by Adam Schefter. The same guy who said Mike Shanahan was going to the University of Florida as a head coach in 2002. In fairness, Schefter also broke the story that Plummer was being benched after the Thanksgiving game and that proved to be true. So his reliability is about 50/50.
If you think about it, retirement's probably the best move for Plummer. I don't think he'd find a starting gig anywhere (south of Canada that is) and going to a new city and being a backup would be a pain in the ass. Rumors today mentioned Tampa Bay.
He's somewhat of a free-spirit, so he'll be okay without football.
dynamite kido - March 2, 2007 11:21 PM (GMT)
Dude, Plummer is good enough to start SOMEWHERE.
Big F'N Swigg - March 3, 2007 10:59 PM (GMT)
ESPN is saying that the Donkey's sent Plummer to Tampa Bay for a conditional pick. Plummer has to show for them to get the pick. And then they report that Tampa Bay has signed Jeff Garcia
And The Broncos also get Dan Wilkinson for a 6th round pick.
eStragand - March 4, 2007 08:51 AM (GMT)
I didn't even know Dan Wilkinson was still in the league. That's not good. Has he done ANYTHING of note since being drafted #1 overall?
S.T. Strickler - March 4, 2007 02:21 PM (GMT)
My 49ers have made out pretty well in Free Agency so far. Lost out on Adalius Thomas, but they did get Nate Clements, Ashley Lelie, Michael Lewis (Eagles safety), and some nose tackle from Baltimore named Aubrayo Franklin. And now I'm hearing Jerry Porter, former LB for the Steelers, is interested in going to San Fran.
Mad Dog - March 4, 2007 03:08 PM (GMT)
Joey Porter. Jerry Porter plays for Oakland.
S.T. Strickler - March 4, 2007 03:58 PM (GMT)
My mistake. Meant to say Joey Porter.
dynamite kido - March 4, 2007 08:23 PM (GMT)
Wow, Joey Porter playing for the 49ers? THAT would be weird.
Mad Dog - March 4, 2007 08:40 PM (GMT)
The 49ers have something like 30 million under the salary cap. So they have a lot of room to upgrade at several positions.
eStragand - March 4, 2007 08:53 PM (GMT)
Strick...getting Ashley Lelie isn't anything to get excited about. A good 2nd wideout at best. The next ball he makes an effort for will be the first.
All this roster perusing has led to me my New Most Favoritest Player: the Donkeys have a back-up/practice squad fullback named Thump Belton. That's the greatest name ever for a fullback. Even better than that CFL linebacker named Kabongo.
Mad Dog - March 4, 2007 09:01 PM (GMT)
He definately won't be the first option for Alex Smith. Probably not even the second option with the tight ends they have.
Mad Dog - March 4, 2007 09:43 PM (GMT)
Browns sign Eric Steinbach. Good move for them as he's a great guard.
S.T. Strickler - March 4, 2007 10:56 PM (GMT)
| QUOTE (Mad Dog @ Mar 4 2007, 04:01 PM) |
| He definately won't be the first option for Alex Smith. Probably not even the second option with the tight ends they have. |
Other than '04 with the Broncos, Lelie hasn't done that much.. And Mad Dog, you don't have to worry about the TE situation in San Fran. Two words: Vernon Davis.
eStragand - March 5, 2007 06:26 AM (GMT)
| QUOTE (S.T. Strickler @ Mar 4 2007, 03:56 PM) |
| Other than '04 with the Broncos, Lelie hasn't done that much. |
Again, this is where numbers lie. Looking at it from a distance, you can say "wow. He had 1,000 yards! He must be good". He was invisible for about half of that season. At no time, did anybody (fan or coach) think "well, we've got LELIE out there! Try and stop us!".
Javon Walker had a similar yardage total this year, but Walker's season was light years beyond Lelie's 2004.
Lelie does have one good trick in his bag. He's a master of "if I can't catch it, fall down and fake the interference call". He makes little to no effort for each ball thrown his way and when he can't catch it, he tries to look "astonished" then looks to the ref for an interference call. He's not a physical receiver at all. That's been the knock on him his whole career, and it's true.
Mad Dog - March 5, 2007 06:50 AM (GMT)
Lelie's numbers definately lie to people. He's only good for long yardage situations. So what happens is he catches 2-3 balls for big yards and it looks impressive but at the end of the game he really had little impact on things. And he can't catch shit up the middle. It's all uncontested shit where there's no chance of him getting hit by a DB trying to pull one in.
eStragand - March 5, 2007 07:46 AM (GMT)
| QUOTE (Mad Dog @ Mar 4 2007, 11:50 PM) |
| Lelie's numbers definately lie to people. He's only good for long yardage situations. So what happens is he catches 2-3 balls for big yards and it looks impressive but at the end of the game he really had little impact on things. And he can't catch shit up the middle. It's all uncontested shit where there's no chance of him getting hit by a DB trying to pull one in. |
Exactly right, Coach Dog.
Mad Dog - March 5, 2007 05:14 PM (GMT)
Texans are taking a big gamble and sign Ahman Green. That will either be a great signing or a total disaster.
dynamite kido - March 5, 2007 05:18 PM (GMT)
| QUOTE (Mad Dog @ Mar 5 2007, 11:14 AM) |
| Texans are taking a big gamble and sign Ahman Green. That will either be a great signing or a total disaster. |
Wow, I was surprised to read that. They paying him big bucks?
If he's healthy he'll be worth it, but that's a big if.
Mad Dog - March 5, 2007 05:31 PM (GMT)
They haven't released the numbers yet. My gut feeling is they overpaid to get him.
dynamite kido - March 5, 2007 05:47 PM (GMT)
| QUOTE (Mad Dog @ Mar 5 2007, 11:31 AM) |
| They haven't released the numbers yet. My gut feeling is they overpaid to get him. |
Which is a horrible idea.
dynamite kido - March 5, 2007 06:03 PM (GMT)
I just looked up Green's deal.
4 years for $23 million
Mad Dog - March 5, 2007 06:09 PM (GMT)
Ok, that's not an awful deal then.