I was just curious as to what annoys everyone here about the entire Internet Wrestling Community aka Smartmarks.

The thing that had me thinking of this was reading a thread over at DVDVR about who is currently better, Joe or Umaga. There's always been smartmarks on the internet and now there seems to be somewhat of a backlash against those mentalities. I just wanted to see where everyone here stood on the subject....

I think everyone's just a bit pissed about the "know it alls" of the internet. I think it's just part of everyone wishing they could enjoy wrestling like they used to before they knew so much backstage stuff

I've expressed my disgust with net fans before. Whether Smartmark, or anti, I just hate the follow-the-leader mentality. The Joe/Umaga thread was a pretty good picture of that. Umaga is a good character, but saying he's a better wrestler than Joe just doesn't make sense. If he's better than Joe, he's better than basically any other wrestler on TNA's roster, or ROH's roster. Jamal isn't bad, but people are really getting a little markish over his character development and booking.

Anyone who thinks just because they said something, it means it's right. I don't see that happening here, but in my travels.

People who don't seem to get any enjoyment out of any wrestling they ever watch. I've seen people who state that they hate WWE, TNA, are annoyed with ROH, are constantly let down by Japan, and scoff at other indys. It makes me wonder exactly why they watch wrestling if they apparently hate every modern form of it.

I've noticed more people getting behind Umaga and Khali than I'd ever expect. People defending them like crazy. UTSU was calling Khali a "great worker" on TSM, and people are backing him. This is stuff I'd never have guessed would happen.

Yeah, the Khali bandwagon is really baffling me. I can understand the Umaga bandwagon, but I haven't really bought into that one either. The character doesn't click with me.

I do find it highly irritating when the net fans all decide to backlash against someone they were verbally sucking off the year before. It happened to AJ Styles and now there are signs that Joe is the next target.

Exactly, Aj Styles is a bad worker, and Umaga and Khali are great. Don't get me wrong, there's nothing wrong with Umaga...or even Khali really, but they are not on the show to bring the workrate. They are there to play a different part, and they play it well.

Well to say that Umaga is a better worker than Joe is just stupid. But I would agree that Umaga has been used better than Joe has for quite sometime. I guess some smartmarks tend to not be able to see that difference.

Khali isn't a good worker, but it's another reason of he's being used right.

I also agree with Rowe that people tend to watch wrestling and still hate everything. They could easily go enjoy something else, but apparently they hate everything wrestling related........and they still watch it.

They also say that as if AJ Styles doesn't play his role on TNA shows well either. Styles has consistently been one of the best reasons to watch TNA since it opened up, and he almost always delivers in his big matches.

I would agree, but people will always tend to bring up some dumb ass argument about shit.

Personally I've thought that AJ has made quite the nice transition over to the HEEL side this time around.

Yeah, AJ's heel turn was just what he needed at this point in his career. And after watching Impact last week, I couldn't help but feel like Joe is being used correctly too. He acts like he owns the Impact Zone.

See I would like to think that Joe is being used correctly, but I can't say that.

Steiner is the guy for the role that he's currently playing.

Joe should be in the role that everyone is afraid that he's going to get close to the NWA title, and they aren't doing it up that way.

A good worker is one who can consistantly have good matches with various opponents. Is that required to be entertaining? No, but it helps to have some of those guys on a WRESTLING show. Another example would be Benjamin / Haas. Clearly, they have not been booked to be as entertaining as Umaga right now. Does that mean they aren't as good workers as Umaga? If you think that you're crazy. Obviously either guy could put on better matches with more opponents. Umaga's character is being used correctly right now, and being played by a DECENT worker, but let's not go overboard. Hey, y'all remember when Mark Henry was a good worker, like a year ago?

Oh yeah, I remember the Mark Henry bandwagon last year. Granted, Henry was being booked arguably the best in his career, and had a couple of decent/good matches, but he still managed to stink the joint up on more than one occasion. There seems to be a mistake in the smark community where they view improvement as "OMG, HE ROX!"

I would probably agree with that assessement. Someone like Rick Rude is generally considered a great worker, although that can be argued. He was just put in the right position with the right people at the right time.

Mark Henry is a good example as he's more booking than he is worker. I would say that Umaga is a decent worker who is way above Henry, but it is a good example.

The internet and its "smarks" are just something that isn't going to change or go away, so I've learned to just live with it and deal with it. As long as there is a place to discuss wrestling, there are gonna be huge douchebags that want to draw attention to themselves by being different and being an antagonist.

Now, moving on to the great part b of this two part thread. Joe and Umaga are both entirely different creatures and characters. So it is impossible to say who is "better", with no criteria being thrown out there for what they are better at....

I will however say that seeing Joe for a while now, doing a few different things, with a few different opponents, that may in fact have been exposed as not being the amazing worker I thought he was. He seems to lack the subtle psycology and intangibles that make him into that "next level".

Umaga on the other hand, was always a good worker (especially for a big man) and has really taken his gimmick to that next level. Right now Umaga is one of my top 3 favorite workers in the WWE, and I can quickly name many workers in TNA that are better than Joe (Low Ki, Shelley, Daniels, Aries....just to name a few).

So for me. Right now. Umaga > Joe.

Wow. You seriously think Low-Ki, Shelley, Aries, AND Daniels are better workers currently than Joe?

The only problem with Joe in TNA has been bad booking. Seriously.

Yes, I do. I've seen approximately an equal amount of all of them, and I've seen everyone but Shelley live.

Just being honest, not smarky.

Same here, but I would be curious to see if you've thought that recently or for awhile???

Swigg, I don't even think his booking has been bad. He's been booked as a top guy in TNA pretty much from day one. His program with Steiner was miraculous, and though rushed, his program with Angle has produced some nice matches.

jamie, not trying to be argumentative, but would you elaborate on those things that Joe lacks? I was slow to get on the Joe bandwagon, but he's won me over now. He may not portray a character, but he can have a darn nice match with anyone.

Low-Ki- Not his fault, but TNA isn't doing anything with him.
Shelly - Has been very entertaining, but not really in the ring.
Daniels - Daniels is just not good anymore in my opinion. It's a shame, because I've always been a mark for him. He needs some time off to refocus.
Aries - Once again, TNA just isn't doing a lot with him.

I think the matches with Angle have been ok, but the storylines haven't done either guy any justice.

And I'd love to see Daniels take some time off, and come back under James Mitchell's "tutelage"

Ewww. I definitely don't want to see that. I'd like to see a full departure from the fallen angel thing. If you've ever noticed when Daniels was with XXX as champs, they'd come out all dressed up in some pimpin' gear. Just totally nice fashion kind of stuff. Daniels looked so natural like that. I'd like him to take that route with a cocky heel personality, and just see where he could go.

I always wanted to see him go farther with the "Fallen Angel" thing, but if he did what you just said, I'd want to see them just call him "Christopher Daniels"

Yeah, no doubt. I'm just a little burnt out on "cult" angles. Nobody ever follows through on them. The early days of the flock I guess were the best.

See I don't think cocky heel works for Daniels. Honestly, I have trouble getting ANY believablility out of him, and that's not the right way to go.

Daniels should be playing the veteran role right now that Lynn is doing. Otherwise, I have no interest in him currently. He does need time off or just a break from TV for a little while.

Maybe he wouldn't work as the cocky heel alone. Honestly, I was thinking like one of the junior memebers of Evolution. I could see him working nicely in that sense, but TNA doesn't really have the other tools to fill a group like that.

The ECW mutants who act like they actually watched it in the 90s but then when you think about it that's impossible because they would've been like 10 when ECW was actually on TNN.

Also the people that act like WCW was a bad wrestling company. Of course these people never actually have seen WCW other than whatever's popped up on a WWE DVD. For all of it's faults, WCW always did wrestling better than the WWE.

That's very true. The wrestling was very good, the booking not so much

And I was waiting for a "Mutant" comment in this thread.

I comment on the mutants because it's all pretenders these days. For every person that actually watched ECW there are at least 5 that never did.

I accept that

Which I actually like.

Why? Because I started watching ECW back in 95/96. I actually remember the time of being a wrestling fan that was pissed off because wrestling sucked hard in 95/96 in WCW/WWF. ECW was the answer to that and was easily the best company overall in 1995.

Ahhhh, the good ol days.

I was reading DVDVR and the lucha section in particular. Those morons actually think AAA is a better promotion than CMLL. And they all hate Mistico because of course being popular makes you suck or something. Whatever floats their boats I guess.

Yeah, I was reading that the other day about Mistico. I also find it funny how basically the whole board has turned on Punk over there too.

God there's a thread over there now that I couldn't even get through 2 pages of. Some jackass is arguing that MVP is better than Punk...

You can say a lot of things about me and my negativity but I've always been consistent in my views.

Regardless, at least you aren't a fucking moron.

You also seem to just have your likes and dislikes and that's it. The DVDVR is good for a lot of interesting stuff, but there really is a whole group of people who turn on shit because it's popular, and then all of the sudden start defending the uber popular stuff because so many people shit on it for being popular. I can't even begin to fit in over there. Partially because I'm pretty easily entertained by most products except for TNA and CZW. But also because they're retarded "opinions" are so quickly changed it makes my head spin. And it's not like it's two or three people, either. Seriously, two months ago MVP was uniformally shit on over there. Now, I do believe he has improved immensely very quickly, but now all of the sudden he's Christ. And you can dislike CM Punk if you wish, but to compare him to the scummiest of scum just can't possibly be your true appraisal of his ability.

The Punk thing is odd to me. When he was just starting to get a bigger name during the early part of this decade he was rated correctly by smarks. He was viewed as an above average worker that had good matches with good workers and had bad matches with bad workers. Then he became the most overrated guy on the net due to Joe doing an amazing carry job on him. Now, if there is backlash he's probably underrated from what he was. Then once the E fires him he'll probably go right back to being the most overrated man on the internet once he rejoins RoH.