So this guy has been wrestling for four years now and he still wrestles like he just got off Tough Enough. Seriously has he shown any signs of progress since 2001? I think he learned a sleeper hold has been his big break through.

Just to give you an idea of how sucky he is. Scoot Andrews started his wrestling career in 2001.

The difference being that Scoot has worked indies around the country, working different styles against different opponents.

I can't think of one worker that was brought up under the WWE development system who has made remarkable improvement. Since WWE went to it's "safe" style around 2002 or so, and every match has pretty much been the same, you can't expect anyone to really grow as a wrestler when that's all they've known. The best you can hope for is that the entertainment part of the wrestler can grow and the in-ring can be adequate enough to not drag everything down.

I agree with that. The safe style is like wrestling for dummies these days. Though I think even his progress within the WWF style has been crappy. His mic skills are ok but he's still wrestling like a guy who just graduated from a school.

Oh well, he'll probably be replaced by generic hoss #683574953.

Maven really has nothing to offer. He has a good look to him for a midcarder, but his promos are, in a nice way, not very good. His in ring ability is very limited considering he's been on the main WWE roster for most of his tenure and has had only a short few month stint in OVW.

He's definitely not bad, but not someone I would pay to see challenge for the Intercontinental Title. While some consider less titles = better, having only 2 real mens titles limits all the lower card people. You don't have people like Maven or Steven Richards fighting for the Hardcore or European Title, which is the only titles I would ever let them hold.

I think, out of OVW, Shelton Benjamin, Cena (to an extent) and You Know Who have made the most improvement


But yeah, Maven sucks

Cena I have to disagree with. He hasn't improved at all since making his debut, and he was nothing special to begin with. The guy has actuallyu gotten progressively worse than when he was around in them Summer of 2002.

Compare Batista to his OVW days and his short stint as Deacon Batista. You wouldn't believe how much he's improved in every category. He's gone from the most heatless guy on the roster (see November-December 2002) to one of the more popular heels and has a nice cult following.

If Rico was still around, I think he made a pretty good improvement by the time he was fired compared to his earlier matches... minus the gayness of course.

Shelton Benjamin has improved slightly, but he was already talented when he was in OVW back in 2001. Charlie Haas I would say still has some room for improvement.

Randy Orton... blech. The guy fucks up everything he does, and he's currently on his 3rd finisher (that he's fucked up a few times already). He's not even close to being comfortable on the microphone, and his in ring work has so much resting he makes Christian look great.

Christian > Orton though.

I still think Christian is being buried, but how and ever

Wow. Take away the little bit about Orton at the end there, and you have my thoughts exactly. ;)

Yeah, I've actually seen some of his UPW work, which may have been better than his OVW work, which is miles ahead of his WWE work.

He was talented in OVW, but his WWE stuff with Team Angle blows it out of the water. Definitely a huge improvement, but kind of plateaued since then.

His push is disproportionately large compared to his skills, but he's nowhere near as bad as you make him out to be. He's competent in the ring and can be carried.

In my personal opinion, Maven is finished. He has not shown any signs of improvement since the last time I marked out for him at all (late 2002 against Chris Nowinski).

Did Scoot Andrews really just start in 2001? He is at least 5X the competitor that any of these OVW call-ups are, that is really impressive.

I should really consider giving him a better push in my diary...

Babyface Orton I hate, so I have a bias against him. Funny though, since when he's a heel, he's decent enough not to hate. I guess cocky heel is better than dumbass face with a lame ass pose.

I know exactly what you mean. I became an admitted fan of him last year from about march until august (when he turned face). Since then I've gone back to being annoyed by him like I was from June 2003 until February 2004.


In a minor spoiler to future episodes of my diary, Orton eventually turns heel... and suddenly I enjoy writing him more.

Yeah, they mentioned on the first Ring of Honor show that Scoot was one of the rookies of the year in 2001.

Color me impressed. The first time I saw him wrestle was on the Era of Honor Begins and I thought he wrestled a damn good match against Xavier.

My problem with Orton is that he comes across like a complete and utter tool most of the time. The other problem is that he just doesn't have the promo skills and when he actually does something cool he ruins it with his stupid looking poses.

"RKO, or not to RKO. That, is the question!"

I'm almost afraid to ask what the fuck you're talking about.

EWR, it's a wrestling simulator and people like to post what's going on in their federation on forums. You can see some in the fantasy folder here.

Here's my problem with Face Orton.

Survivor Series, he pounds down Edge (i think), and POSES. And then done it again against Batista. Thats why I 've called him the Trained Monkey

Oh okay, that makes sense. I avoid fantasy stuff at all costs.

I know this is a little off topic, but I'll throw it out there anyways since Scoot was brought up.

I highly recommend checking out some of his ECWA stuff from I believe 2001-2002 where he was working a lot with American Dragon, Low Ki, Christopher Daniels.......he held his own nicely in those matches.

LoL. That does sound pretty bad when taken out of context.

And the fantasy folder isn't so bad, most people seem to enjoy it B)

It's one of the more popular folders... amazing. On (board-that-shall-not-be-named) it WAS the worst.

Hmmm wasn't this thread about Maven??

I think that Maven should have a lot more than 5 moves to his arsenal by now. He has a good look to him and he's young, but that is really all he has going for him. Even though the booking at the PPV was horrible and Maven was buried yet again on Raw, he shouldn't have had a title match to begin with. Who can take him seriously now??

Wait, Maven does 5 moves?

Why? 5 is pretty much the standard these days. That's all one needs to work WWE heavyweight style, and he doesn't know any other style.

Let's see... Dropkick, Arm-drag, Uh... Missile Dropkick... Even if that DOES count, I can't think of anything else he's done.

Sounds about right to me.

They already fired Nidia and may or may not have fired Linda Miles... why not add Maven to the list?

He does a sleeper hold too.

Linda Miles either quit or was fired, depending on who you hear it from. (Considering Cornette verbally bashed her for sucking on many levels, I can assume fired)

I think she was fired for sucking and a shitty attitude.

Another funny note, in this past weeks observer Meltz talks about a HBO Documentary about Linda Miles's college basketball team (the actual team is escaping me right now....and it's not that important anyway) and he even said that there were a few moments in the docu. that she was arguing with her Coaches and teammates. So apparently she is an all around asshole.

I never watched the Tough Enough she was on but was she a bitch on that show too?

She just seemed like she was overly confident. I don't think the real bitch in her came out until she was in OVW or in the WWE managing the Bashams.

She actually came across as being nice on TE2, but I really did not like that season one bit (Season 3 is my personal favorite).

I've heard many different rumors as to why or how she left WWE, but I think the bottom line is that she's not coming back (so Bradshaw can sleep well at night).

Funny that watching Tough Enough, I thought he most deserved to win the show because he had the most potential. How wrong I was. People were speaking of his moves, funny that it seems he was doing more on Tough Enough as he was LEARNING, than he is in the ring 4 years later.

I've hated Linda Miles since the first second I saw her on Tough Enough. I have a natural ability to know if I'll hate someone before knowing anything about them... and I'm usually right.

<---hated Orton when he first debuted in 2002 on Smackdown too.

No one has ever annoyed me more than that whore Jamie on the third season.

Whore? I thought she was a disgusting pig... I guess that is just as bad. I was routing for Matt Cappawhatever the entire time. Something about his look stood out from the others (and not in a tall hoss way either).

I just remember my friends and I cheered for about 10 minutes when she got voted off at the end.