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Title: Rey
Description: Can he Carry the title?


whitemilesdavis - January 30, 2006 08:02 PM (GMT)
So, you see the question and I'd say the general consensus here is "Yes". I'd have to say no, though.

I hate to say it, but he's just too small. It's completely unrealistic fo him to be considered the baddest man on earth. His style has never proven to work in WWE main events, and he's not a good promo.

I love the guy, and think he should be pushed more than he is...but not World title levels.

jamiegeist - January 30, 2006 08:15 PM (GMT)
The height argument is so tired and old. Eddie Guerrero was 5'9" and no one seemed to have a problem with him beating Brock Lesnar.

Mysterio loses 5 inches, but is much quicker than Eddie.

Besides, if Cena has shown us anything, its that reactions are what gets you a World Title. He was over with the crowd, so they put the strap on him. Despite the fact that he can't do a goddam thing in the ring. I don't "buy" Cena as a legit World Champion, and its cause he can't do more than 5 moves.

But if he can be champ, Rey sure as hell can.

And people always bring up this 'World HEAVYWEIGHT Champion' argument. Thats usually from people too stupid to realize that it is a name, and a name only. This isn't boxing where you have to qualify at a certain weight to compete. Benoit and Eddy held titles at just over 200 pounds, which is "cruiserweight levels", so go any lighter and it really doesn't matter.

whitemilesdavis - January 30, 2006 08:25 PM (GMT)
QUOTE
The height argument is so tired and old. Eddie Guerrero was 5'9" and no one seemed to have a problem with him beating Brock Lesnar.


Eddie had Rey by 5" and 40lbs and a load of wrestling skill. Yes, I said it. Eddie was a much better wrestler than Rey Mysterio.

QUOTE
Besides, if Cena has shown us anything, its that reactions are what gets you a World Title. He was over with the crowd, so they put the strap on him. Despite the fact that he can't do a goddam thing in the ring. I don't "buy" Cena as a legit World Champion, and its cause he can't do more than 5 moves.


Not a great example, because like you said, Cena's not legit either. Look what his reign did for business. Nothing. He got boo'ed out of every building in the country.


QUOTE
And people always bring up this 'World HEAVYWEIGHT Champion' argument. Thats usually from people too stupid to realize that it is a name, and a name only. This isn't boxing where you have to qualify at a certain weight to compete. Benoit and Eddy held titles at just over 200 pounds, which is "cruiserweight levels", so go any lighter and it really doesn't matter.


In boxing (as in wrestling too) you are completely free to move UP in wieht if you can get someone to fight you. Roy Jones was the most recent to move up and succeed as an undersized heavyweight. The idea with wrestling is to keep it somewhat believable. Marvin Hagler was a bad, bad man at about 170lbs. Larry Holmes (220lbs) would have killed him. Literally. The same thing would happent o little Rey if he were to fight Batista or Mark Henry.

jamiegeist - January 30, 2006 08:30 PM (GMT)
Most sources list Eddie at 5'9" and Rey at 5'4". Are you calling Rey flat 5 feet? And regardless of "wrestling skill", I think we're talking kayfabe terms here, and Rey's quickness makes up for his lack of "mat wrestling" if you wanna call it that.

My example with Cena is assuming we're again talking in kayfabe. They're booing Cena because of his direction, which is controlled by Vince. I don't generally hate the guy. I hate the lame ass "character" and his limited moveset, which I'm sure they don't want him expanding. I hate his lame ass promos, which are most likely written for him before the show. And ratings are looking better over the last month than they have in a while.

I thought the question you were asking is "Can Rey win the title", or "Will Rey win the title". If you wanna talk about what it will do for business, well, thats a different question altogether, and I don't know the answer, and neither does anyone else.

whitemilesdavis - January 30, 2006 08:34 PM (GMT)
QUOTE (jamiegeist @ Jan 30 2006, 04:30 PM)
Most sources list Eddie at 5'9" and Rey at 5'4". Are you calling Rey flat 5 feet?

Typo.

Scrooge McSuck - January 30, 2006 08:37 PM (GMT)
The underdog story is a method that almost always works, depending on who the underdog is. Rey has been getting some of the best reactions for the last couple of years, despite midcard burials and worthless CW Title Feuds.

whitemilesdavis - January 30, 2006 08:40 PM (GMT)
QUOTE
My example with Cena is assuming we're again talking in kayfabe. They're booing Cena because of his direction, which is controlled by Vince.


How can we be talking kayfabe, and about his character direction at this time?

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And ratings are looking better over the last month than they have in a while.


Yeah, they spiked after Cena lost the belt.

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I thought the question you were asking is "Can Rey win the title", or "Will Rey win the title". If you wanna talk about what it will do for business, well, thats a different question altogether, and I don't know the answer, and neither does anyone else.


No, the question was: Can Rey be a legit World Champ? Another way to say it would be, will the public buy him as a champ, or is he the right guy to put the belt on?

whitemilesdavis - January 30, 2006 08:41 PM (GMT)
QUOTE (Scrooge McSuck @ Jan 30 2006, 04:37 PM)
The underdog story is a method that almost always works, depending on who the underdog is. Rey has been getting some of the best reactions for the last couple of years, despite midcard burials and worthless CW Title Feuds.

Sometimes the odds are too big, and the underdog tale becomes unbelievable. I just can't buy into it.

Colcollazo - January 30, 2006 08:51 PM (GMT)
Fuck whoever said no. He's the most over guy in the company, and the he's best worker in the company too. I don't give a fuck how tall Rey is. Neither does everyone who watches the product. He's been so over for so long now that it's becoming ridiculous.

dynamite kido - January 30, 2006 08:52 PM (GMT)
QUOTE (whitemilesdavis @ Jan 30 2006, 02:02 PM)
So, you see the question and I'd say the general consensus here is "Yes". I'd have to say no, though.

I hate to say it, but he's just too small. It's completely unrealistic fo him to be considered the baddest man on earth. His style has never proven to work in WWE main events, and he's not a good promo.

I love the guy, and think he should be pushed more than he is...but not World title levels.

Normally, I agree with most of the stuff you post here WMD..............this ISN'T one of those normal times though. Rey certainly can carry the title and he'll do well. Why? Simple. Because first and foremost, he can wrestle anyone in the company to a good match. Secondly, because Rey is the kind of babyface champion that they've always wanted. His size and moveset alone allow him to stay in the good graces of their fanbase for as long as they need him too. Plus, they have the UNDERDOG of UNDERDOGS in Rey. They could build his stuff up to making money...........and the hispanic fanbase is one that ALL shows are currently fighting for on TV, so he'll help them there too.

Scrooge McSuck - January 30, 2006 08:58 PM (GMT)
I wouldn't tell WMD to fuck off Colcollazo, but I see where you're coming from. I've been skeptical, but Rey IS the best choice, hands down.

jamiegeist - January 30, 2006 09:02 PM (GMT)
QUOTE
No, the question was: Can Rey be a legit World Champ? Another way to say it would be, will the public buy him as a champ, or is he the right guy to put the belt on?


Okay then. Yes. Yes. and Yes.

whitemilesdavis - January 30, 2006 09:51 PM (GMT)
Like I said in the first post, I figured the majority here would say yes. I didn't figure to be on an island though. Surely someone sees my point.

I hope I'm wrong, rey wins the belt, and it is a huge success. I just don't get it. They've never evebn had the confidence to put a midcard singles title on him, much less a world title.

Scrooge McSuck - January 30, 2006 09:53 PM (GMT)
I think everyone can see where you're coming from. WWE has trained us all to think "little men have no business being in main events. Go hosses!" I was thinking the same way a few weeks ago unti I realized there really is no other choice.

Mark Henry - It's Mark Henry!

Chris Benoit - WWE only gave him the title to try and boost the buy for WM by doing the "he's waited 20 years for this."

Randy Orton - I don't like him unless he wrestles Benoit, and he's in a midcard angle with Booker still.

Booker T - keeps retiring and unretiring every day.

whitemilesdavis - January 30, 2006 09:59 PM (GMT)
QUOTE
I think everyone can see where you're coming from. WWE has trained us all to think "little men have no business being in main events. Go hosses!" I was thinking the same way a few weeks ago unti I realized there really is no other choice.


That's honestly not the case with me. Rey is an extreme case when it comes to being small. Somewhere around 5-8 210lbs, I wouldn't say a thing.

Everybody is focusing on my size comments, but I also said he couldn't cut a promo, wouldn't fit WWE main Event Style, and he wears a mask.

Scrooge McSuck - January 30, 2006 10:03 PM (GMT)
OK...

Promos: Who says he had to cut promos? Benoit rarely did during his 5 months as champ in 2004, and when he did, they were short and to the point.

Main Event Style: This is a myth created by Meltzer to try and blind people into thinking you need to be a hoss to main event in WWE.

Mask: It sells merchandise?

Mad Dog - January 30, 2006 10:55 PM (GMT)
Shawn Michaels has less credibility than Misterio build wise and everyone has to sell for him like he's Superman.

I think Misterio can carry the title.

jamiegeist - January 31, 2006 01:19 AM (GMT)
Yeah, I agree that Shawn really does have less credibility in the physique department than Rey. Shawn looks like an old skinny dog. Thats the only way I can describe it, but he just doesn't look threatening at all. Rey on the other hand, while being short, is ripped and has quite the impressive physique/muscles. And yeah, Shawn does make alot of people his bitch.

As for promos, I've never had a problem with Rey on the mic. He just never has gotten the chance to say much of anything.

In the wrestling style department, I just disagree. I think Rey's style can work well with anyone, especially the standard superstars (Triple H, Angle, Benoit, Orton kind of size) because of the variety of things they can do together. I'll agree he becomes limiting when in their with a Hoss like Kane, Taker, Show, or Mark Henry (my apologies to Kane, Taker, and Show for linking them to that turd) but then again, whose style isn't dramatically affected and shitty when in their with those guys.

And the mask is part of the package. It does sell merchandise, kids love it. And it gives Rey an aura of mystery (haha) that he has rebuilt since being unmasked in WCW. It also gives him a true tie to his Mexican heritage and traditions under which he was raised.

I actually hate the fact that this whole thing has to be "for Eddy", because Rey should be able to do it on his own, without that being the main story here. I like it as a back story, but not as the driving force.

Scrooge McSuck - January 31, 2006 01:33 AM (GMT)
I disagree with one thing... the "doesn't work well with big guys" list. His matches with Show and Kane in singles and tag in November-Decemer were all well booked and pretty interesting matches, and his bumping makes them look more impressive than when they do it to people much bigger than Rey.

The only problem is Rey needs to cheat to beat them, with chair shots or other tactics like that, since WWE has taught us "Heels > CW's".

Big F'N Swigg - January 31, 2006 01:36 AM (GMT)
I'm on both sides here. I think he could do it, but I don't necessarily think he should.

TheGreatWhiteChoate - January 31, 2006 02:53 AM (GMT)
QUOTE (dynamite kido @ Jan 30 2006, 04:52 PM)
QUOTE (whitemilesdavis @ Jan 30 2006, 02:02 PM)
So, you see the question and I'd say the general consensus here is "Yes". I'd have to say no, though.

I hate to say it, but he's just too small. It's completely unrealistic fo him to be considered the baddest man on earth. His style has never proven to work in WWE main events, and he's not a good promo.

I love the guy, and think he should be pushed more than he is...but not World title levels.

Normally, I agree with most of the stuff you post here WMD..............this ISN'T one of those normal times though. Rey certainly can carry the title and he'll do well. Why? Simple. Because first and foremost, he can wrestle anyone in the company to a good match. Secondly, because Rey is the kind of babyface champion that they've always wanted. His size and moveset alone allow him to stay in the good graces of their fanbase for as long as they need him too. Plus, they have the UNDERDOG of UNDERDOGS in Rey. They could build his stuff up to making money...........and the hispanic fanbase is one that ALL shows are currently fighting for on TV, so he'll help them there too.

Completely agree with that.

prof_plague - February 2, 2006 02:38 AM (GMT)
I think Rey has proven himself as a talent, and as one of the best wrestlers in the WWE now. With Mysterio's style, he might be able to draw crowds again, nothing like Hogan, obviously, but enough to help out the company.

eStragand - February 3, 2006 07:07 PM (GMT)
Wouldn't be a long-term champ, but he does have that silent charisma. He just shows up, does his thing and folks cheer him.

It also helps that his current entrance is pretty cool. It's been a positive WWE addition to his character. The way he jumps up, in synch with the fireworks, is a nice visual.

I haven't talked wrestling with my dad in a LONG time, but if Rey won the title, I'd probably say "hey, guess who's the WWF Champ? Rey Mysterio". Dad's response would be "that little shit who got launched into the side of a trailer? Cool." Of course, neither of us would ever buy a PPV...but we'd be be happy.

Spawnie Guy - February 3, 2006 07:12 PM (GMT)
Rey Mysterio is the only cruiserweight from the old WCW days that WWE actually used properly and now he is the most over WWE wrestler to not be a main eventer. Orton should job to him flat out and let Rey get a big title win at Wrestlemania. Shit, Angle should be a heel after fueding with Undertaker so might as well.

prof_plague - February 3, 2006 07:16 PM (GMT)
I'm still trying to figure out this Angle (half)-turn.

jamiegeist - February 3, 2006 09:26 PM (GMT)
Rey's entrance is killer, yes. And I posted a few weeks ago about hating Rey's new (not really new anymore) music as opposed to his old theme.

But really, its grown on me too, especially once the Dominica-Beat kicks in. Good jam.




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