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Kash/Noble vs Kendrick/London on Velocity, Henry/Rey II, Benoit/Orton and maybe Angle/MNM. Yup, SD is doin it.

WOW, I'm actually surprised that Benoit got the win.

Looks very solid. I'm still fucking pissed that Velocity is internet-exclusive, but Smackdown itself should be very fun.

That's exactly the word for it: solid. As long as it's good in spots in passable in others, I'm happy.

That's basically how I feel about it too. Sad thing is, I usually NEVER feel like RAW is solid.....

But Raw's not pre-taped. If Raw was pre-taped, I honestly would probably never watch it, except for maybe the occasional match these days. Smackdown is an entirely different case: It's pre-taped, so I can decide if I want to watch it or not.

The answer lately has been yes.

Tag Champs going down in a handicap match again? Cmon!

And Rey losing AGAIN!? to Mark Henry.

Must be to set up his rumble win. :)

It damn well better be setting it up for Rey to win. :angry:

Smackdown looks... decent. Since I always tape Smackdown (usually), I'll just fast forward to Funaki/Finlay and Angle/MNM. :P

Yeah, even though I'm unhappy with the Tag Champs in a handicap match again, I'm excited to see what MNM can do with Angle. MNM has really been impressing me recently.

Yeah I agree that having MNM job to Kurt Angle is pretty stupid, considering MNM was able to hold their own against Batista AND Rey. Am I suppose to buy that Kurt Angle is stronger than Batista AND Rey combined? WWE logic, oh how I loathe thee.

I was waiting to see how long it would take for a WWE midcarder to use the Musclebuster

The musclebuster is hardly the most original move. Maybe Finlay did it years ago in WCW. :D

It doesn't matter. It's the same regardless.

Do you need me to point out that TNA wrestlers no-sell WWE finishers all the time? I posted a small review of random Impact matches from 2005 on another board, and at least three times, moves that were done by WWE wrestlers as finishers were either no sold completely or just ignored as being devistating.

Dude, chill. I know it goes back and forth. I was just waiting to see who would do the Muscle Buster

One final note: How do we know it was the musclebuster? Maybe it was a brain buster and the guy reporting it fucked up. :)

It's true. We'll see Thursday

That's because 90% of the WWF uses some variation of a powerbomb as a finisher.

Nice to see Misterio jobbing again when he should be the champion.

A musclebuster is a variation of the fisherman brain buster, which, like the powerbomb, involves dropping someone hard on the back of their neck. My point.

Too bad Finely had his moveset absolutely raped by the WWF style. The only move he's probably still allowed to do is that fireman's carry into a slam move he does.

I don't even know what you guys are arguing about.

I think the argument is both WWE and TNA are having their wrestlers steal and/or no sell finishing moves used primarily by the other promotion.

I think wrestlers, or road agents who assing finishers, or the people in charge of creative have people use certain finishes because they a) can execute them well and B) they look affective and work within the context of wrestling.

I seriously doubt anyone even mentioned Samoa Joe when Finlay decided to use it......IF he used it, other than maybe "I'll be using the musclebuster, that move Samoa Joe uses".

I don't see where this is going, and I don't think TNA "has people kick out" of effective WWE finishers. If anything, TNA is ahead of the game, and doesn't think people are buying a Rock Bottom for a finish anymore.

(That was the only move I could think of people "no selling" or kicking out of in TNA recently, off the top of my head)

Off the top of my head and without looking up my review, almost everyone no-sells and/or kicks out of Abyss' chokeslam, even guys who have been on job duty like Chris Sabin who should be dead after it considering the notable size difference. The chokeslam is used as a finisher for both the Big Show and Kane, and sometimes the Undertaker.

And?!

Its a chokeslam. I know you love Kane, but cmon....it really isn't a devastating move in today's day and age. This is a silly argument Scrooge.

First off, I don't think anyone is telling people to kick out of it BECAUSE it is a chokeslam, in an attempt to spite the WWE or Kane/Taker/Show, or to somehow diminish the move.

TNA lives in a different world, with a different set of guidelines. Chokeslams kill people dead in the WWE, so what. The Rear-Naked Choke (a glorified chinlock, sure) kills people dead in TNA. They are two different beings, that exist in 2 different worlds. To compare them is silly.

No one is trying to tarnish or diminish other peoples move. TNA is trying to be different. The finishers in TNA are much more impactful (Musclebuster), aesthetically appealing (Styles Clash), and just plain awe-inspiring (Canadian Destroyer) than the finishers in WWE. Therefore, a chokeslam? Thats not really gonna get the job done in TNA.

Monty Brown uses a fucking TACKLE. Abyss does a sidewalk slam. Ron Killings a scissors kick. None of these move scream "OH MY GOD AWESOME !!!"

Abyss uses a "Bossman Slam", not that I want to start that discussion again. And to be honest, Abyss Black Hole Slam does routinely look very impactful and a bit awesome. Killings uses the same move as Booker T, so I'm not sure where you are going with that one.

I gave you two arguments. There is the 'TNA is higher impact' argument. Which I agree with for the most part. There is also the 'TNA exists in a different time/space' which you totally ignored. Refer to my response above....it doesn't matter what moves kill people dead in the E...because they aren't one in the same.

I have no argument for Monty Brown. He sucks. The pounce sucks. Its gay as hell. I just....can't.

Didn't Trytan (or whoever that tall sucky guy was) win matches with a chokeslam back on the FSN days? I honestly don't remember, since the Xplosion replay would usually clip out his matches (thank god)? Or maybe Kevin Northcutt? I seem to remember one of those Red Shirts guys winning matches with chokeslams.

Or maybe Erik Watts.

I think Watts might have used one.

Even if he did, that means nothing. The "kayfabe" idea of a finisher is that the person is a specialist of that move, which is why they use it and it gets the job done, and why opponents don't routinely use the same move. They aren't specilists.

Abyss' finish isn't the chokeslam. Maybe he just doesn't have it quite "perfected" the way that Big Show, Undertaker, and -- Oh sweet jesus I can't even finish this thought.

You're fuckin wrong Scrooge. Sorry. You're just way off the mark with this one, and I'm not sure how to make it any simpler. I tried reasoning it, and it makes less sense than the actual truth. So please, tell me where you're coming from. I'm honestly not sure if its your blind TNA hate, your massive Kane (chokeslam?) love, or just your pure ignorance at 12 am.

And I think you're wrong. Promotions always do petty shit like making a big finishing move look weak. WCW and WWF did it all the time, most notably WCW having Disco Inferno do a stunner that was almost always kicked out of. Swiggy made a big deal that someone used Samoa Joe's stupid musclebuster, insinuating WWE did it to take a shot at TNA, and I responded that TNA does it all of the time too, and gave ONE example. I'm sorry I don't study every god damn match. TNA is known for doing their best to take shots at WWE (planting signs, the little universal studios situation last year, praising their own PPV's over their "competitons", etc. etc.), so it's not out of the question they have their wrestlers no sell WWE's main eventers finishing moves.

First off, Swigg did no such thing.

I don't know how that is "insinuating WWE did it to take a shot at TNA". To me, it isnt. To me it is saying "I wonder how long it will take before a WWE midcarder starts using the Musclebuster, becasue it is a kickass move".

"Promotions always do petty shit"? We have one example to go off of...that being WCW and WWF back in the day. I never thought of Disco using the stunner as the least bit disrespectful, and I definitely don't remember people kicking out of it routinely either. I just figured the dude needed a finisher, and it was one of the hottest things going. It worked too, cause it helped get him over. Anyone would pop for a stunner back then -- anyway.

To sum it up, you seem to think TNA "takes shots" at WWE. I honestly haven't seen any of that. They aren't low-brow about it if they do. Saying your PPV is the best thing on PPV right now is just....well its true, and it is also just smart business. You think they should undersell themselves?

During one of their commercials (which ran until the next PPV), they had something saying "Final Resolution blows "the competitions show" from a few weeks ago away." (except it was more insulting against WWE) It's OK to put yourself over, but where's this competition coming from? There's no need to say that. I never heard Jim Ross say "Our PPV last night kicked WCW's ass." Maybe WCW did it, but look where they are now.

Jesus Scrooge, you aren't even making sense now. You sound like one of those mindless idiots from the tard boards.

Jim Ross didnt say "our PPV kicked WCW's ass"?

Right, and neither did Tenay, or the ad, or whatever you are saying.

Thats a respectful claim at being the best. You're just throwing up fucking hail marys here trying to dig yourself out of your suddenly TSM-like hole.

For real here. I'm not trying to start some kind of tard-feud. I was having a discussion, and I just don't think you're making valid points or even listening to yourself. From what I've read from you here, you can't possibly think the things you are writing, cause I know you aren't that stupid.

I think you misunderstood Swigg, and generated your own little world and story out of it. It just snowballed from there. Its all good.

You're right. I took Swigg's comment out of text, and made a big stink out of it. I'm still pissed though, that a JTTS like Chris Sabin is kicking out of a move that even Triple H has done the job for.

I understand. But for real, I think the only way to look at it and to have it make sense is not put them in the same universe.

That gets complicated when Christian is on WWE in the same month as TNA. But really, especially in regards to finishers....it isn't even the same league. The same rules don't even apply.

I know you guys are having a serious discussion, but I find it fucking hilarious when you two argue. Especially when jamiegeist says "you're fucking wrong Scrooge." Hilarious.

That was quite entertaining. I'd pay to see you two in a big flame war.

Glad we could be of service.