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Title: I hate to say it but....


Mad Dog - December 9, 2005 10:56 PM (GMT)
I've really enjoyed the last 4 or 5 matches that Jarrett was in. All fun brawls for the most part. He performs pretty well in brawls where he's getting his ass kicked.

Big F'N Swigg - December 10, 2005 03:21 AM (GMT)
I don't mind many of his matches, just the endings. And the fact that he has the belt.

dynamite kido - December 10, 2005 03:25 AM (GMT)
QUOTE (Mad Dog @ Dec 9 2005, 04:56 PM)
I've really enjoyed the last 4 or 5 matches that Jarrett was in. All fun brawls for the most part. He performs pretty well in brawls where he's getting his ass kicked.

I would agree with that. Although I just see no point to him being on top constantly.

Big F'N Swigg - December 10, 2005 03:28 AM (GMT)
I had written a couple of paragraphs about how he could actually earn some credibility and maybe even the top spot of TNA. But I can't find it now. Though I agree with the fact that he earns much of the hate he gets.

jamiegeist - December 10, 2005 09:02 PM (GMT)
In a sentence I'm sure will come back to haunt me: I find him no less credible on the top than Triple H. I view them as one in the same. Just different companies. They can both work, when motivated. They both hog the spotlight because of their situation backstage. And they both have this fucked up complex that the company "can't do well" without them on top, holding the strap.

Big F'N Swigg - December 10, 2005 09:12 PM (GMT)
Very true. Though I will say that HHH has proven himself more than Jarrett.


jamiegeist - December 10, 2005 09:22 PM (GMT)
Triple H had a hot run back from around when Foley put him over big, to I would say, his quad injury or shortly before that.

I honestly would have bought Jarrett as a top heel just as much, if not more, than I bought Triple H as a top heel when they shot him into it with the wedding angle.

Triple H has had TONS more oppurtunity to "prove" himself than Jarrett ever had. I was way into Jarrett around the time he was with Owen and Debra, doing the "don't piss me off" thing, and when he was rumored to start a program with Austin, which reportedly Austin vetoed.

Big F'N Swigg - December 10, 2005 09:24 PM (GMT)
Jarrett's problem is that he's stuck in the same gimmick. HHH has at least evolved some. Jarrett is cutting the same promos and being the same character as he was when he ME'd WCW

dynamite kido - December 10, 2005 10:36 PM (GMT)
As much as I hate both of them, I have no problem saying that I think that HHH is MUCH better in the ring than him.

Although they both tend to think they are better than what they really are in the ring regardless..............

Mad Dog - December 10, 2005 11:24 PM (GMT)
I'd take Jarrett over HHH. Jarrett at least sells for everyone and doesn't win his matches clean like HHH does.

jamiegeist - December 10, 2005 11:33 PM (GMT)
QUOTE
Jarrett's problem is that he's stuck in the same gimmick. HHH has at least evolved some. Jarrett is cutting the same promos and being the same character as he was when he ME'd WCW


I hope you aren't suggesting that Triple H has evolved. Oh wait...you plain old said it. Please explain.

prof_plague - December 10, 2005 11:43 PM (GMT)
QUOTE (Mad Dog @ Dec 10 2005, 05:24 PM)
I'd take Jarrett over HHH. Jarrett at least sells for everyone and doesn't win his matches clean like HHH does.

But shouldn't heels win at least some matches cleanly? If anything, you sometimes get pissed off more because the cheater just won cleanly and make you hate that wrestler more as a heel character.

dynamite kido - December 11, 2005 01:40 AM (GMT)
QUOTE (Mad Dog @ Dec 10 2005, 05:24 PM)
I'd take Jarrett over HHH. Jarrett at least sells for everyone and doesn't win his matches clean like HHH does.

I'm not saying that HHH should always put himself over the way he usually does, but if you are going to do it.........do it right.

Mad Dog - December 11, 2005 01:44 AM (GMT)
You could get a middle ground between them but Jarrett's the preferrable way to go. HHH is essentially booked as a face and has single handedly castrated the every potential big name face over the last couple of years. Jarrett's only big crime during the same time frame was Raven but there were outside forces at work there.

People also forget that Jarrett's first reign in TNA was a proven draw and quite good. Something that Triple H can't say for his entire career except when he was facing two of the biggest stars ever.

TheGreatWhiteChoate - December 11, 2005 02:04 AM (GMT)
I hate them both. You're never going to convince me that Jarrett is anything more than a mediocre wrestler with very little appeal, which definitely isn't the type you want headlining your entire show. Triple H is marginally better, but really, I could live without either of them. Easily.

Big F'N Swigg - December 11, 2005 09:33 PM (GMT)
QUOTE (jamiegeist @ Dec 10 2005, 05:33 PM)
QUOTE
Jarrett's problem is that he's stuck in the same gimmick. HHH has at least evolved some. Jarrett is cutting the same promos and being the same character as he was when he ME'd WCW


I hope you aren't suggesting that Triple H has evolved. Oh wait...you plain old said it. Please explain.

HHH's character was first the sledgehammer weilding badass, then he became the "cerebral assassin," then he tore his quad and became the Motorcycle jacket/Iron Cross "Game," then the suit wearing leader of Evolution. They're subtle changes, but they're changes that at least keep him from looking the same as he did four years ago. Jarrett's character is the same, minus the "Slapnuts." Same gay ass tights, same lack of reason to care. For all the hell I've given HHH in the past, he's at least kept his character fresher than Jarrett

dynamite kido - December 11, 2005 09:59 PM (GMT)
QUOTE (Mad Dog @ Dec 10 2005, 07:44 PM)
You could get a middle ground between them but Jarrett's the preferrable way to go. HHH is essentially booked as a face and has single handedly castrated the every potential big name face over the last couple of years. Jarrett's only big crime during the same time frame was Raven but there were outside forces at work there.

People also forget that Jarrett's first reign in TNA was a proven draw and quite good. Something that Triple H can't say for his entire career except when he was facing two of the biggest stars ever.

Wait a minute. You can't say that Jarrett was a "proven draw" during his first reign compared to ANYTHING Triple H has ever done. The audience size alone should be an indication of that. Otherwise, Samoa Joe would have been one of the biggest draws in recent memory, but since it was little ol ROH...........it's simply not the case.

Jarrett has fucked over plenty of people during his time in TNA and they are still paying for it. If it wasn't for JJ raping Killings and Raven..........they'd BOTH be in main event positions with the company and they'd be credible in being there. Same thing with Monty, but JJ cut him off at the balls too and they are STILL trying to bring him back up. It's going to fuck them big time if JJ eventually does it to Christian too.

whitemilesdavis - December 11, 2005 11:39 PM (GMT)
You can't have a booker who wrestles. It's just a conflict of interest.

Mad Dog - December 12, 2005 04:02 AM (GMT)
QUOTE
Wait a minute. You can't say that Jarrett was a "proven draw" during his first reign compared to ANYTHING Triple H has ever done. The audience size alone should be an indication of that.


Jarrett's title defenses consistently saw the buyrates spike during his first reign. HHH has never been a proven draw and the audience has decreased by almost 40% since his big run started.

dynamite kido - December 12, 2005 05:14 AM (GMT)
QUOTE (Mad Dog @ Dec 11 2005, 10:02 PM)
QUOTE
Wait a minute. You can't say that Jarrett was a "proven draw" during his first reign compared to ANYTHING Triple H has ever done. The audience size alone should be an indication of that.


Jarrett's title defenses consistently saw the buyrates spike during his first reign. HHH has never been a proven draw and the audience has decreased by almost 40% since his big run started.

It's hard to say if Jarrett did ANYTHING for the ratings during his first run though. Especially because it could have been a whole bunch of things that could have done that. Mainly it could've been the fact that the title was even being defended at that point..............not because of Jarrett at all.

jamiegeist - December 12, 2005 05:33 AM (GMT)
QUOTE
QUOTE (jamiegeist @ Dec 10 2005, 05:33 PM)
QUOTE
Jarrett's problem is that he's stuck in the same gimmick. HHH has at least evolved some. Jarrett is cutting the same promos and being the same character as he was when he ME'd WCW


I hope you aren't suggesting that Triple H has evolved. Oh wait...you plain old said it. Please explain.

HHH's character was first the sledgehammer weilding badass, then he became the "cerebral assassin," then he tore his quad and became the Motorcycle jacket/Iron Cross "Game," then the suit wearing leader of Evolution. They're subtle changes, but they're changes that at least keep him from looking the same as he did four years ago. Jarrett's character is the same, minus the "Slapnuts." Same gay ass tights, same lack of reason to care. For all the hell I've given HHH in the past, he's at least kept his character fresher than Jarrett


You're simply talking about cosmetic changes. I don't wanna get into some trite little flame war here, but that was the worst reasoning I've ever heard. So if Jarrett muscled up, put on a leather jacket, or ran with a new posse.....that would be character evolution?

TheGreatWhiteChoate - December 12, 2005 09:50 AM (GMT)
QUOTE (jamiegeist @ Dec 12 2005, 01:33 AM)
QUOTE
QUOTE (jamiegeist @ Dec 10 2005, 05:33 PM)
QUOTE
Jarrett's problem is that he's stuck in the same gimmick. HHH has at least evolved some. Jarrett is cutting the same promos and being the same character as he was when he ME'd WCW


I hope you aren't suggesting that Triple H has evolved. Oh wait...you plain old said it. Please explain.

HHH's character was first the sledgehammer weilding badass, then he became the "cerebral assassin," then he tore his quad and became the Motorcycle jacket/Iron Cross "Game," then the suit wearing leader of Evolution. They're subtle changes, but they're changes that at least keep him from looking the same as he did four years ago. Jarrett's character is the same, minus the "Slapnuts." Same gay ass tights, same lack of reason to care. For all the hell I've given HHH in the past, he's at least kept his character fresher than Jarrett


You're simply talking about cosmetic changes. I don't wanna get into some trite little flame war here, but that was the worst reasoning I've ever heard. So if Jarrett muscled up, put on a leather jacket, or ran with a new posse.....that would be character evolution?

Wrestling can only do so much in terms of "character evolution". Cohesive storylines and consistent characters would be a blessing, so yes, JJ getting a new posse would count as character evolution. That's more of a statement on the nature of wrestling right now than JJ himself.




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