Title: Dr. Death in DWB HoF?
Description: The HOF returns!
SamoaRowe - August 23, 2005 05:42 PM (GMT)
Title History
Mid-South Tag Team titles w/Ted DiBiase defeating the RockNRoll Express (May 3, 1995);
Mid-South Tag Team titles w/Ted DiBiase defeating the Eddie Gilbert & Nitemare (December 26, 1985);
UWF World Tag Team titles w/Ted DiBiase (recognised-March 1986);
UWF Heavyweight title defeating Big Bubba Rogers (July 11, 1987);
United States Tag Team titles w/Kevin Sullivan defeating the Fantastics (Starrcade 1988);
All Japan Tag Team titles w/Terry Gordy defeating Stan Hansen and Gen'ichiro Tenryu (March 6, 1990);
All Japan Tag Team titles w/Terry Gordy defeating ??? (December 7, 1990);
All Japan Tag Team titles w/Terry Gordy defeating Stan Hansen & Dan Spivey (July 6, 1991);
Real World Tag Team Tournament winners w/Terry Gordy (December 6, 1991);
NWA World Tag Team tTitles w/Terry Gordy defeating Dustin Rhodes & Barry Windham (GAB 1992);
All Japan Tag Team titles w/Bam Bam Bigelow defeating Mitsuharu Misawa & Toshiaki Kawada (January 30, 1993);
All Japan's Triple Crown Heavyweight title defeating Mitsuharu Misawa (July 28, 1994);
All Japan Tag Team titles w/Johnny Ace defeating Mitsuharu Misawa & Jun Akiyama (May 23, 1996);
All Japan Tag Team titles w/Gary Albright defeating Kenta Kobashi & Johnny Ace (July 25, 1997);
Highlights:
University of Oklahoma:
1981: Steve Williams is a graduate of the University of Oklahoma, where he played football and wrestled..
~~~Steve set a then record for the fastest pinfall by pinning Perr Kaufman in twenty seconds..
~~~Steve Williams was named an All American..
Steve was scouted and trained by "Cowboy" Bill Watts when he was a senior in college..
Mid South:
1982: Steve Williams had his first pro match with Billy Starr in Shreveport, LA..
Steve Williams teamed with Andre the Giant against Big John Studd & Super Destroyer (Scott Irwin)..
May 3, 1985: Steve Williams & Ted DiBiase defeated the Rock'n'Roll Express for the Mid-South Tag Team titles..
December 26, 1985: Steve Williams & Ted DiBiase reclaimed the Mid-South Tag Team titles from Eddie Gilbert & Nightmare..
March 1986: Steve Williams & Ted DiBiase were recognized as the first UWF World Tag Team champions..
July 11, 1987: Steve "Dr. Death" Williams pinned Big Bubba Rogers for the UWF title..
National Wrestling Alliance:
Starrcade 1987: Williams defeated Barry Windham..
R.Warriors/S.Williams/R.Garvin/J.Garvin beat K/Sullivan/M.Rotunda/I.Koloff/A/Perez/R.Assassin #1 in a "tower of doom" match..
Starrcade 1988: "Dr. Death" & "Gamesmaster" Kevin Sullivan beat The Fantastics to win the US Tag Team titles..
Great American Bash 1989: Road Warriors/Midnight Express/Williams beat The Freebirds and The SST in a "War Games" match..
All Japan Pro Wrestling:
March 6, 1990: Terry Gordy & Steve Williams defeated Stan Hansen & Genichiro Tenryu for the All Japan Tag Team titles..
December 7, 1990: Terry Gordy & Steve Williams re-claimed the All Japan Tag Team titles..
July 6, 1991: Terry Gordy & Steve Williams defeated Stan Hansen & Dan Spivey for their 3rd All Japan Tag Team titles..
December 6, 1991: Terry Gordy & Steve Williams won the annual Real World Tag Team Tournament in Tokyo..
World Championship Wrestling:
GAB 1992: Terry Gordy/Steve Williams beat Dustin Rhodes/Barry Windham to win the vacant NWA Tag Team titles..
1992: Terry Gordy & Steve Williams defeated the Steiner Brothers to unifying the NWA and WCW tag team titles..
Halloween Havoc 1992: Barry Windham & Dustin Rhodes battled Steve Williams & Steve Austin to a 30 minute draw..
All Japan Pro Wrestling:
January 30, 1993: Terry Gordy & Steve Williams defeated Mitsuharu Misawa & Toshiaki Kawada for the All Japan Tag Team titles..
July 28, 1994: Steve Williams defeated Mitsuharu Misawa for All Japan's Triple Crown Heavyweight title in Tokyo..
May 23, 1996: Steve Williams & Johnny Ace defeated Mitsuharu Misawa & Jun Akiyama for the All Japan Tag Team titles..
July 25, 1997: Steve Williams & Gary Albright defeated Kenta Kobashi & Johnny Ace for the All Japan Tag Team titles in Tokyo..
World Wrestling Federation:
1998: Steve Williams signed with the World Wrestling Federation at the encouragement of Jim Ross..
The WWF set up a "Brawl for All" tourniment for the sole purpose of introducing Steve Williams..
~~~The idea was that Steve Williams would steamroll through the competition and have an instant gimmick..
~~~July 27, 1998: Steve Williams was injured during his first round Brawl For All shoot fight against Bart Gunn..
~~~Due to this 'embarrassment', Steve Williams' push was completely deflated, and eventually released..
World Championship Wrestling:
Steve Williams resurfaces on "Nitro," debuting with Oklahoma (Ed Ferrara), a character mocking Jim Ross..
January 2000: Steve Williams departed for All Japan Pro Wrestling shortly thereafter..
All Japan Pro Wrestling:
June 22, 2002: Steve Williams beat Jimmy Snuka Jr. in Atlantic, NJ..
October 27, 2002 - AJPW PPV: Steve Williams/Mike Rotunda/Johnny Smith beat Yoji Anjoh/Mitsuya Nagai/Ryuji Hijikata..
Semi-Retirement:
May 23, 2003 - WWE Event: Steve "Dr Death" Williams defeats Lance Storm in a rare special appearance..
May 24, 2003 - WWE Event: Lance Storm defeats Steve "Dr Death" Willaims in another special appearance..
June 2003: Steve Williams might be offered a wrestler/trainer position within the WWE to influence a slower in-ring wrestling style..
September 19, 2003 - MLW WAR GAMES: The Funkin Army (led by Terry Funk) beat The Extreme Horsemen (led by Steve Corino)..
~~~Funkin Army = Terry Funk/Sabu/Dr Death/Sandman || Extreme Horsemen = Corino/Diamond/Anderson/Credible/Barry Windham..
December 30, 2003--NWA Mid-Atlantic in China: Steve Williams b Terry Taylor in 32:19 for the NWA Mid-Atlantic HWT title..
April 2004: Steve Williams announced that he has been suffering from throat cancer following his shoot fight at a K-1 event in Japan..
~~~Steve Williams will be having surgery in the coming days to remove a polyp from his throat..
April 17, 2004: Steve Williams was told that his voice box would have to be removed to remove the cancer and seeks additional medical opinions..
October 22, 2004: Steve Williams undergoes another tough operation where they take skin from his leg to patch the hole in his throat..
December 2004: Steve Williams has recovered from his cancer treatments and been added to the January Wrestle Reunion in Tampa..
February 2005: "Dr. Death" Steve Williams has been declared completely free of cancer.
dynamite kido - August 23, 2005 06:01 PM (GMT)
WOW, I would love to hear why someone voted "no" on this one.
Ahem.......
Mad Dog - August 23, 2005 06:06 PM (GMT)
Yeah, that no vote surprised me too.
whitemilesdavis - August 23, 2005 06:08 PM (GMT)
It was from me. I'll give full reasoning a little later.
dynamite kido - August 23, 2005 06:16 PM (GMT)
| QUOTE (whitemilesdavis @ Aug 23 2005, 12:08 PM) |
| It was from me. I'll give full reasoning a little later. |
I'll be waiting...........
SamoaRowe - August 23, 2005 06:28 PM (GMT)
| QUOTE (dynamite kido @ Aug 23 2005, 12:16 PM) |
| QUOTE (whitemilesdavis @ Aug 23 2005, 12:08 PM) | | It was from me. I'll give full reasoning a little later. |
I'll be waiting...........
|
Hehe, this should be good.
I'll admit, I've only really seen Dr. Death's WWF work (though I have a match or two featuring him in Japan on my computer) so I really haven't seen the guy at his best. Sell me on why he should (or shouldn't) be in the HOF.
Scrooge McSuck - August 23, 2005 06:53 PM (GMT)
From a mark perspective, I voted yes. He's always been one of my favorite wrestlers to never (OK, hardly) work for WWE, and his cross-over popularity in Japan gives me an excuse to hunt down some Puro to watch when I have extra cash.
SamoaRowe - August 23, 2005 07:01 PM (GMT)
| QUOTE (Scrooge McSuck @ Aug 23 2005, 12:53 PM) |
| From a mark perspective, I voted yes. He's always been one of my favorite wrestlers to never (OK, hardly) work for WWE, and his cross-over popularity in Japan gives me an excuse to hunt down some Puro to watch when I have extra cash. |
I'm sure he would've been around WWE more if not for the unfortunate Bart Gunn incident.
And they did make a damn good Dr. Death action figure, I know Plague has it.
Scrooge McSuck - August 23, 2005 07:04 PM (GMT)
I have it too... (hides figures in closet) You didn't see a thing! I forgot I nominated Dr. Death like 4 months ago, or at least agreed on a nomination. What took so long? :P
dynamite kido - August 23, 2005 07:20 PM (GMT)
Well, I can give you a few reasons why he should be in.
-He was only the third gaijin to be crowned Triple Crown Champion (The other two were Terry Gordy and Stan Hansen).
-He was the Wrestling Observer Newsletter Rookie of the Year in 1982.
-Was one half of the Real World Tag League winners two years in a row (Him and Gordy won it in 1990 and 1991) Not to mention that in 1991 here were the teams they defeated....
Hansen & Spivey, Tsuruta & Taue, Misawa & Kawada
-Was the last UWF champion until the company was swallowed up by Crockett promotions in late 1987. Also it should be noted that out of the UWF wrestlers that then wrestled in the NWA he was one of the few that was kept and pushed.
-He's another one of the "Successful in the pro wrestling/amateur wrestling world" guys.
-He BEAT cancer.
eStragand - August 23, 2005 10:09 PM (GMT)
First off, I dig Dr. Death....he used to be billed as hailing from Denver! But the way I see it, he wasn't exactly a big name in North America. He'd be in the Hall of Pretty Good, but not Fame. Plus, I can't forgive him for being Oklahoma's tag-team partner and having a cage match against Jerry Only.
But I can't wait for the induction ceremony: we can plug it for weeks and weeks..then Bart Gunn will show up, unannounced, and knock him out.
Scrooge McSuck - August 23, 2005 10:20 PM (GMT)
Go to hell, you homeless old bastard! (throws can of soup)
$20 says this post gets deleted because someone can't take a joke.
Real F'n Show - August 23, 2005 10:46 PM (GMT)
| QUOTE (Scrooge McSuck @ Aug 23 2005, 02:04 PM) |
| I have it too... (hides figures in closet) You didn't see a thing! I forgot I nominated Dr. Death like 4 months ago, or at least agreed on a nomination. What took so long? :P |
I got to choose him for winning a competition in Fantasy Booking. So fuck off. Of course I vote yes.
dynamite kido - August 23, 2005 11:16 PM (GMT)
| QUOTE (Real F'n Show @ Aug 23 2005, 04:46 PM) |
| QUOTE (Scrooge McSuck @ Aug 23 2005, 02:04 PM) | | I have it too... (hides figures in closet) You didn't see a thing! I forgot I nominated Dr. Death like 4 months ago, or at least agreed on a nomination. What took so long? :P |
I got to choose him for winning a competition in Fantasy Booking. So fuck off. Of course I vote yes.
|
You sir..........are a good man.
whitemilesdavis - August 24, 2005 01:14 AM (GMT)
My sentiments are somewhat in line with estragand's. Dr. Death was big in Japan, but not on the strength of his ring work. He was a big, powerful wrestler, and a good brawler. However, if you only look at the Gaijin who fit those categories he is completely overshadowed. Hansen, Gordy, even Vader. In the US, Williams was always the guy on the brink of breaking big, but never really broke. Granted, he was huge in the mid-south territory, but never on a national scale. I don't hate the guy by any means, I actually like him, but I reserve the HOF for something more than an underachieving, bland, average ring worker.
SamoaRowe - August 24, 2005 01:24 AM (GMT)
| QUOTE (Real F'n Show @ Aug 23 2005, 04:46 PM) |
| QUOTE (Scrooge McSuck @ Aug 23 2005, 02:04 PM) | | I have it too... (hides figures in closet) You didn't see a thing! I forgot I nominated Dr. Death like 4 months ago, or at least agreed on a nomination. What took so long? :P |
I got to choose him for winning a competition in Fantasy Booking. So fuck off. Of course I vote yes.
|
Yep, and for future reference, any contest I hold in the Fantasy folder will have choosing a nomination as a prize.
Scrooge McSuck - August 24, 2005 01:27 AM (GMT)
Not to sound like a big hypocrite, but if we're going by successful headliners, then why is someone like Curt Hennig voted in? Sure, he was a great wrestler, but he never drew any considerable amount of money, and was rarely higher than upper-midcard once he came to the WWF in 1988 through the end of his career. Williams, while not big in the states, is a success in Japan, which should be a consideration, considering we also voted in the Great Muta, who was never much in the states either.
SamoaRowe - August 24, 2005 01:30 AM (GMT)
I have felt the same way a few times, Scrooge, but I figure everyone has different feelings towards different wrestlers. For example, Mr. Perfect received almost 100% votes because everyone loves him and wanted him in. However, if someone less beloved, like Mick Foley, is nominated, the fact that he wasn't a big draw for most of his career then becomes a form of arguing why he shouldn't be in.
So I don't really worry too much about why people vote "yes" or "no" anymore, I just like to see how it works out.
Scrooge McSuck - August 24, 2005 01:40 AM (GMT)
So you're saying you don't care one way or another how we vote, and whatever happens, happens. Makes sense to me.
SamoaRowe - August 24, 2005 01:46 AM (GMT)
| QUOTE (Scrooge McSuck @ Aug 23 2005, 07:40 PM) |
| So you're saying you don't care one way or another how we vote, and whatever happens, happens. Makes sense to me. |
Sometimes I'm more biased towards a nominee, but in the end I want the Hall of Fame to reflect the wrestlers who are important to us as fans.
dynamite kido - August 24, 2005 03:06 AM (GMT)
| QUOTE (whitemilesdavis @ Aug 23 2005, 07:14 PM) |
| My sentiments are somewhat in line with estragand's. Dr. Death was big in Japan, but not on the strength of his ring work. He was a big, powerful wrestler, and a good brawler. However, if you only look at the Gaijin who fit those categories he is completely overshadowed. Hansen, Gordy, even Vader. In the US, Williams was always the guy on the brink of breaking big, but never really broke. Granted, he was huge in the mid-south territory, but never on a national scale. I don't hate the guy by any means, I actually like him, but I reserve the HOF for something more than an underachieving, bland, average ring worker. |
I don't know about that WMD. Williams was big in Japan, but he was a big deal in the US as well. He was the last champion the UWF had here in the US before it was swallowed by Crockett promotions, here's his US title history as well....
NWA Mid Atlantic Tag Team Champion(2)
NWA Tag Team Champion
NWA United States Tag Team Champion
NWA Mid Atlantic Heavyweight Champion
WCW World Tag Team Champion (w/Gordy) -It should be noted they won the titles from The Steiners.....
USWA Southern Heavyweight Champion
UWF Heavyweight Champion
UWF Tag Team Champion
1986 UWF $50,000 Challenge Cup Tournament Winner
Which isn't too bad considering every company he worked in he basically held a title.
Keep in mind that the KOing by Bart Gunn killed his career because the WWE brought him in at the time to feud over the WWF Title against Austin. So even though he didn't do much there the WWF was willing to give him a shot at main eventing as well.
SamoaRowe - August 24, 2005 04:36 AM (GMT)
At this rate, Dr. Death will make it in. I notice we've had 7 people vote, so we could have a ways to go (especially seeing as some of the Tournament polls have 14 votes and all).
eStragand - August 24, 2005 04:40 AM (GMT)
Ask yourself this: would you put Terry Gordy in your Hall of Fame?
Gordy's success obviously paralled Dr. Death's and he even held some semi-prestigious singles titles. Gordy was a main event heel in Texas..and held titles in almost every promotion he was in. He was even brought into the WWF to feud with another top-level main event star--the Undertaker. Just like Williams with Austin, Gordy's run tanked. The similarities are there. Plus, both guys had the same sort of ring approach: big burly brawlers.
UWF was kinda' cool... but it wasn't on the same level as the "big three". I don't think many people consider Terry Taylor's UWF title reigns as significant.
As for Hennig--- he received alot of acclaim because his ringwork was more technical. That always lands extra appeal (see also: Dynamite Kid). Guys like Hennig and Dynamite awed you with their moves... but Dr. Death's clotheslines, punches and powerslams didn't awe you in the same way.
whitemilesdavis - August 24, 2005 12:04 PM (GMT)
Yes, I have several criteria and draw is one of of them. However, I am waited more towards ring work / classic matches, so if Williams would have been a little better in the ring (like Terry Gordy) I would have voted him in, despite his drawing power in the US.
dynamite kido - August 24, 2005 01:27 PM (GMT)
| QUOTE |
| Ask yourself this: would you put Terry Gordy in your Hall of Fame? |
Yes, I would. For several reasons.............
| QUOTE |
| Gordy's success obviously paralled Dr. Death's and he even held some semi-prestigious singles titles. Gordy was a main event heel in Texas..and held titles in almost every promotion he was in. He was even brought into the WWF to feud with another top-level main event star--the Undertaker. Just like Williams with Austin, Gordy's run tanked. The similarities are there. Plus, both guys had the same sort of ring approach: big burly brawlers. |
Well, Gordy was the first gaijin triple crowd champion. Gordy was more than a main event heel in Texas...........he was a main member of the Freebirds. Also, Gordy was NOT brought in to fued with Undertaker. He was brought in to play The Executioner. Williams was legit being brought in to feud with Austin as HIMSELF.
| QUOTE |
| UWF was kinda' cool... but it wasn't on the same level as the "big three". I don't think many people consider Terry Taylor's UWF title reigns as significant. |
Taylor never had the UWF title.
| QUOTE |
| As for Hennig--- he received alot of acclaim because his ringwork was more technical. That always lands extra appeal (see also: Dynamite Kid). Guys like Hennig and Dynamite awed you with their moves... but Dr. Death's clotheslines, punches and powerslams didn't awe you in the same way. |
Hennig was a good worker, and Dynamite was innovative. With that being said it doesn't mean that Williams was worse as a worker because he wasn't totally innovative. Some consider Bret Hart to be the greatest wrestler ever...........he didn't innovate a thing as far as wrestling style goes. He used a formula and it worked. I'm not saying that Williams is a better worker than any of them but still..........he was damn good in his prime...........and yes, he was WAY better than Gordy.
dynamite kido - August 24, 2005 01:28 PM (GMT)
| QUOTE (whitemilesdavis @ Aug 24 2005, 06:04 AM) |
| Yes, I have several criteria and draw is one of of them. However, I am waited more towards ring work / classic matches, so if Williams would have been a little better in the ring (like Terry Gordy) I would have voted him in, despite his drawing power in the US. |
I must ask, how much have you seen of both? I'm asking because I always thought that Williams was a much better worker than Gordy EVER was......
Scrooge McSuck - August 24, 2005 02:11 PM (GMT)
Williams had an amatuer background, and was pretty good at throwing people on their heads with slams and suplex's. Gordy was just a big guy with long hair who looked like a beast who relied mainly on brawling.
dynamite kido - August 24, 2005 02:59 PM (GMT)
| QUOTE (Scrooge McSuck @ Aug 24 2005, 08:11 AM) |
| Williams had an amatuer background, and was pretty good at throwing people on their heads with slams and suplex's. Gordy was just a big guy with long hair who looked like a beast who relied mainly on brawling. |
Exactly..........
whitemilesdavis - August 24, 2005 03:09 PM (GMT)
| QUOTE (dynamite kido @ Aug 24 2005, 09:28 AM) |
| QUOTE (whitemilesdavis @ Aug 24 2005, 06:04 AM) | | Yes, I have several criteria and draw is one of of them. However, I am waited more towards ring work / classic matches, so if Williams would have been a little better in the ring (like Terry Gordy) I would have voted him in, despite his drawing power in the US. |
I must ask, how much have you seen of both? I'm asking because I always thought that Williams was a much better worker than Gordy EVER was......
|
I've seen tons of both, seriously, and I would consider Gordy worlds above Williams. Williams to me was mostly generic power moves, while Gordy was a fantastic brawler (one of the best) and his selling and bumping were on a whole different level from Williams.
Real F'n Show - August 24, 2005 03:09 PM (GMT)
| QUOTE (eStragand @ Aug 23 2005, 11:40 PM) |
| Guys like Hennig and Dynamite awed you with their moves... but Dr. Death's clotheslines, punches and powerslams didn't awe you in the same way. |
So.
Dr. Death dropping Kobashi on his head with a backdrop driver is not awe inspiring?
dynamite kido - August 24, 2005 03:16 PM (GMT)
| QUOTE (whitemilesdavis @ Aug 24 2005, 09:09 AM) |
| QUOTE (dynamite kido @ Aug 24 2005, 09:28 AM) | | QUOTE (whitemilesdavis @ Aug 24 2005, 06:04 AM) | | Yes, I have several criteria and draw is one of of them. However, I am waited more towards ring work / classic matches, so if Williams would have been a little better in the ring (like Terry Gordy) I would have voted him in, despite his drawing power in the US. |
I must ask, how much have you seen of both? I'm asking because I always thought that Williams was a much better worker than Gordy EVER was......
|
I've seen tons of both, seriously, and I would consider Gordy worlds above Williams. Williams to me was mostly generic power moves, while Gordy was a fantastic brawler (one of the best) and his selling and bumping were on a whole different level from Williams.
|
Considering that Williams has better matches against almost everyone that Gordy wrestled in Japan, I would argue that statement. Plus, I don't know how you could say that Williams used generic power moves and then commend Gordy for his brawling. Brawling IS generic too as far as offense goes. Williams HAD technical skill, Gordy didn't. Also, Gordy was blown away on drugs most of his career and it effected his working.............I can't say the same for Dr. Death.
By the way, I wish all of our HOF inductees could bring up this much debate/convo.
SamoaRowe - August 24, 2005 03:23 PM (GMT)
| QUOTE (dynamite kido @ Aug 24 2005, 09:16 AM) |
By the way, I wish all of our HOF inductees could bring up this much debate/convo. |
All of them did for a while, but when the discussions died down, I figured a break was in order.
I am loving this thread so far.
whitemilesdavis - August 24, 2005 03:26 PM (GMT)
| QUOTE |
| Plus, I don't know how you could say that Williams used generic power moves and then commend Gordy for his brawling. |
The contradiction was generic vs. fantastic. I'll take a fantastic brawler over a generic power wrestler any day. The two aren't the same, by the way. Power wrestling more involves picking people up in a variety of ways and throwing them down, whereas brawling is more punching, kicking and choking. Depending upon the wrestler, either style can be great, or it can suck. Look at a Gordy puch against just about anyone else's. It looks better, more real and more painful. That is not generic, because it stands out. Same when he kicks a guy laying in the corner. Everyone has done that, sure, but when Gordy does it...well, it's great. Then just some of the crazy mannerisms, and bumping and selling, that's pretty much the definition of a great worker. I don't think the drugs affected Gordy's ring work as much as the brain damage from the comas.
eStragand - August 24, 2005 04:11 PM (GMT)
| QUOTE (Real F'n Show @ Aug 24 2005, 09:09 AM) |
| QUOTE (eStragand @ Aug 23 2005, 11:40 PM) | | Guys like Hennig and Dynamite awed you with their moves... but Dr. Death's clotheslines, punches and powerslams didn't awe you in the same way. |
So.
Dr. Death dropping Kobashi on his head with a backdrop driver is not awe inspiring?
|
Key phrase is "same way". Two different styles I'm pointing to. It's like having Mike Alstott or Clinton Portis. Both pick up yards, both are good backs, but they do it different ways. One is the big bull-runner who dukes it out and runs you over.. the other is more speed and quickness.
Note..this is a comparison... I'm going to mail you a baggie of my spooge if you start reciting Williams 40 yard dash time to Dynamite Kid's. "Williams ran to the ring in 8.73 seconds, when Dynamite actually made it down in 9.34......in Japan."
...and there's still the cage match with Jerry Only and tagging with Oklahoma :)
Scrooge McSuck - August 24, 2005 04:17 PM (GMT)
I'll admit, Steve Williams going along with the Oklahoma thing in WCW really pisses me off, considering he's J.R.'s "boy". But that's not enough to keep him out. Heck, he gets my vote based on him mauling the Hardyz when he made his return to WWF after Bart Gunn injured him in the Brawl for All.
<---really doesn't like the Hardys.
eStragand - August 24, 2005 04:25 PM (GMT)
| QUOTE (dynamite kido @ Aug 24 2005, 07:27 AM) |
| Taylor never had the UWF title. |
I should have specified the UWF TV Title. Yes, it was their secondary belt, but the point is it didn't do wonders for his career.
whitemilesdavis - August 24, 2005 04:26 PM (GMT)
The UWF was crap anyway. It was never taken as the world class orginization that it tried to present itself. Mid-south was a great territory, but that was all but over by the UWF days.
dynamite kido - August 24, 2005 04:51 PM (GMT)
| QUOTE (whitemilesdavis @ Aug 24 2005, 09:26 AM) |
| QUOTE | | Plus, I don't know how you could say that Williams used generic power moves and then commend Gordy for his brawling. |
The contradiction was generic vs. fantastic. I'll take a fantastic brawler over a generic power wrestler any day. The two aren't the same, by the way. Power wrestling more involves picking people up in a variety of ways and throwing them down, whereas brawling is more punching, kicking and choking. Depending upon the wrestler, either style can be great, or it can suck. Look at a Gordy puch against just about anyone else's. It looks better, more real and more painful. That is not generic, because it stands out. Same when he kicks a guy laying in the corner. Everyone has done that, sure, but when Gordy does it...well, it's great. Then just some of the crazy mannerisms, and bumping and selling, that's pretty much the definition of a great worker. I don't think the drugs affected Gordy's ring work as much as the brain damage from the comas.
|
I couldn't disagree with you more WMD. Also, I understand the difference between brawler and power wrestler.
I wouldn't say that Williams was a generic power wrestler any more than Gordy was a generic brawler. Have you ever seen Dr. Death vs. Kobashi from 8/31/93? If so, I REALLY have no clue how you would consider him to be remotely generic. Also, I do find it funny that we are comparing two guys that are known for being in a team TOGETHER. Strange isn't it. The drugs certainly affected his work later in his career..........that's why AJ never put the Triple Crown on him again.
whitemilesdavis - August 24, 2005 05:08 PM (GMT)
Keep in mind that I REALLY like Williams, and you have already said you'd put Gordy in the HOF. Neither of them suck.
dynamite kido - August 24, 2005 05:19 PM (GMT)
Oh, there's no doubt. I just don't see where you don't think Williams is a decent worker.